EPISODE DESCRIPTION:

Stem cell exosomes are quickly becoming one of the most talked-about breakthroughs in regenerative medicine. In this episode, we sit down with Caleb Granger of Apex Regenerative to break down what exosomes actually are, how they work inside the body, and why they may outperform traditional stem cell therapies.

We cover inflammation, tissue repair, aging, chronic disease, and the exploding research happening around exosome signaling. If you’ve heard the hype around stem cells, anti-aging therapies, or regenerative medicine — this conversation will change how you think about healing and recovery.

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Transcript:

Liz Roman: [00:00:00] Welcome back to the Health Revival Show. Today we have Caleb Granger and we are gonna be talking about stem cell exosomes. He is a leading businessman and owns Apex regenerative, and so we are excited to dive in today to help you understand that we can heal anything and reverse aging literally. And one of the big things I'm excited to learn about from you, Caleb, is how this can be in reach for people financially as so many believe that this cost.

Hundreds of thousands of dollars and only the pros and the celebs can access these things, but in fact you provide them to so many people who it's, life changing. And so we're just excited to dive in today. And I will say we might get a little spicy, we might get a little juicy. So if your kids are in the car, just.

Know that you're on the Health Revival Show, and this is a special episode. You may wanna come back and listen later, but I'm excited to dive in. So just tell us a little bit about you. How did you get into the world of exosomes and what your history is and maybe your personal experience using exosomes.

Caleb Granger: [00:01:00] Sure. Awesome. Thank you ladies. Really glad to be on. Thanks for having me. And it's a great topic. This is, in my opinion, having been in medicine and healthcare for now, 26 years, by far the most exciting innovation. It's the most exciting new understanding that we have is about stem cell exosomes and what they do in the body.

Let me start there. Many people haven't heard the word exosome. E-X-O-S-O-M-E. The stem cell exosome is a tiny particle that is secreted from the stem cell. And people know of stem cells, they know about stem cells as these little healing factories. Every body has stem cells, the amount of stem cells, the potency of the stem cell, how much it heals, and the number of new cells.

Every day that you create that are stem cells, those three things all reach their peak when we're about 18 or 20 years old, and then start declining after that. So the stem cells are in our body. [00:02:00] They do all the healing and you can look back and say, Hey, when I was a kid, I healed from these things really quickly.

Now, I'm 50 years old, for instance, and I don't heal as quickly as I did when I was 17. A big part of that is. The number of stem cells that I have has precipitously declined. The potency of each of those cells has also gotten weaker, so the healing capacity of those cells has gotten weaker, and the number of new stem cells that I produce every day has gotten smaller as a ratio in terms of the total number of cells.

What we thought 20, 30 years ago was stem cells were first discovered mesenchymal stem cells. There was a guy named Arnold Kaplan, who coined that term mesenchymal stem cells described what they did and how they healed in the body. The idea was to take stem cells either from yourself, which is called autologous.

So you take your own cells, concentrate them, spin them down in a centrifuge, concentrate them, sometimes feed them and replicate them, make them even more powerful, and then put them back [00:03:00] into your body. For instance, put 'em back into a degenerated knee. That was one use of autologous cells. Another use was to take cells from somebody else, mesenchymal stem cells from a donor, and then do the same thing.

Try to put it in a specific area, maybe do a systemic treatment. And the idea was you would increase somehow your regenerative capacity, either acutely in one area or systemically. And that new regeneration, those new healing cells would somehow take hold, help you heal. And over time, 1690 days and beyond.

In graft in your body and eventually differentiate into new tissue, right? So if you put it in a knee that was lacking cartilage, you'd put these cells in. And the thought was that if you put a bunch of these healing cells, kept track of 'em and kept 'em healthy and alive, put 'em into an area that needed them, that eventually they would grow and differentiate and become new tissue.

What we now know is that never happened. So that was for the last [00:04:00] 25 years, that's what we thought happened. We thought that you'd get stem cells, they would engraft, turn into new tissue. We now know, and this knowledge came in the late 2010s and has been continued into the 2020s. It is the recognized fact.

The way stem cells work when they're doing their healing is by secreting healing signals, so the healing signals that they send out, that they produce, their proteins, growth factors and regenerative signals that the stem cells create. Those are carried and communicated via these tiny particles called exosomes.

So the way we now know that stem cells work is they in your body secrete exosomes. The exosomes carry the proteins, growth factors and regenerative signals, the healing blueprints that tell the rest of your body, tell all the other cells where and how to heal. In fact, we have now found that if you get a stem cell injection or infusion today of [00:05:00] live stem cells, doesn't matter if they're yours or if they're somebody else's.

99% of those cells are dead or flushed by the body within 24 hours or less. The other 1% is flushed or killed it. The body is an incredible efficient flusher of bad things. And so they see those cells as a foreign intruder, even if it's your own cells that have been processed. You get those cells in, they are immediately flushed and killed.

If there is any benefit that is derived from those treatments. It is from the exosomes that those stem cells secreted in the short time that they were alive in your body. So if they're all killed within 24 hours, in those first 23 hours, they're secreting exosomes. Those exosomes start a healing cascade that then continues on.

If you get a good result from stem cells, one of the negatives is. When you're doing stem cells taking a stem cell infusion or stem cell injection, it's, they're inherently [00:06:00] inflammatory. So if any of your listeners have gotten a stem cell injection, inevitably they were told, Hey, expect for the next week or two, you're gonna have some significant inflammation if you're getting stem cells in your knee, yes, stay off your knee for at least a week.

Because there's this massive inflammatory response. That inflammatory response is the body responding to this foreign material and killing all that foreign material almost immediately. So that's not good, right? But that is a known thing with stem cell injections. Exosomes have no cell they're cell free.

And so with exosomes, what we can do is, and what we do at Apex Regenerative, we take the most potent. The most healing stem cells that the human body ever creates. There's zero day old placental and umbilical mesenchymal stem cells. We take those cells after a healthy, full-term delivered pregnancy. US only donors [00:07:00] with rigorous testing, rigorous inclusion criteria, including the mother who donates her placental material.

Can't have one tattoo. For instance, because there is some small risk of they could get a, needle stick infection, and so they, even if you have one tattoo, you can't donate your placenta material. We test for 300 plus diseases. You can't have ha you can't have COVID, you can't have taken the vaccine.

The mother cannot have it. For our specific donation criteria, we take that. Zero day old live tissue. Get the memal stem cells from that tissue, elicit the exosomes from those stem cells, and that's what we process, package and deliver in a variety of ways. IV sublingual spray intranasal spray.

Injection subq injection topically, et cetera. There's a variety of uses and wherever exosomes interact with the body, they seek out any [00:08:00] deficit from perfect and start repairing that deficit. So it is really just a matter of, how many exosomes is the matter of what your condition is, the duration and severity of that condition times using exosomes as an intervention, a healing intervention, and how many exosomes you get over what period of time.

And so that's what our protocols focus on is given your condition, how many exosomes do you need over what period of time and what we can reproducibly do. Is increase your body's regenerative capacity. It's gross regenerative capacity to the point that now it overwhelms your degeneration and starts moving in the direction of regeneration.

At 50, 60, 70, 80 years old, 90 years old my dad was 93. Started exosomes after seven years of acute kidney failure. Had one kidney at 0% function, one kidney at 20% function for seven years, [00:09:00] started exosome protocols. Within four months, his 20% kidney was at 90% function. At 93 years old with no other lifestyle change, no other medication, this is what we see reproducibly.

It's simply a matter of raising your regenerative capacity until it overwhelms your degeneration like it used to when you were a kid. 

Becca Chilcz: Yeah. Oh my gosh. First of all, I'm gonna fly my dad down there. Second of all, my, my dad has, we can talk offline. But from what I understand, exosomes are like the straight line to healing, whereas stem cells, there's some stops along the way and essentially like a big stop that they are flush from the body.

And I also. Have been told, maybe this is not true, but that stem cells can somewhat feed unhealthy cells like they can. They can feed like senescent cells in the body and cause a, with potentially inflammation that they drive a negative reaction. Whereas exosomes are just like the straight line.

It is. There's no in-between. There's no [00:10:00] enzymatic processes that have to happen. It's just. Exosomes are the healing agent and they are not affected because they are not cell bound essentially. Is that kind of in layman's terms? 

Caleb Granger: That's exactly right. 

Becca Chilcz: Okay. 

Caleb Granger: Yeah that's exactly right. So with a whole cell, there's three things that a whole cell can do that it's really tough for an exosome to do.

A whole cell carries whole genetic information. That's important. If you're using your own cell well, you have your own. At a 50-year-old, my own toxic, environmentally toxic, all the dings that my cells have taken up to that point, I'm just taking those out and putting it back in. I'm not getting some new level of regeneration.

It contains all the bad stuff that I already had in my body. If you're taking it from somebody else, if you're getting allogenic what's called donated stem cells, and for instance, the donor has a genetic predisposition towards cancer [00:11:00] and you, the recipient don't have a genetic predisposition towards cancer.

If that cell does take hold, you now have a some percentage chance of gaining a new genetic predisposition towards cancer. It passes on full genetic code. Another thing it can pass on is full viral and bacterial load. So while everything is tested rigorously, if as long as these cells or exosomes are taken from FDA accredited and audited tissue sourcing facilities, which of course we are, and American Association of Tissue Bank, audited and accredited facilities, there's super strict criteria for the sourcing.

Processing, manufacturing, packaging and distribution of human tissue. Super strict, and so there's really not it's really rare that you would have any tissue at all, right? Even full tissue, like skin tissue, ocular tissue. All the things that are lifesaving that come out of tissue [00:12:00] donations, even for those to have any sort of issue is just super, super rare.

It's even more rare to have a cellular level component pass on some viral or bacterial load, but it is possible. And so those are the things that you're talking about is some genetic malformation, viral or bacterial load with exosomes, they can't carry those things. They're mechanically too small to carry those things.

They don't cause inflammation and they have in higher concentrations all the good things that the stem cells produce that their source cell produced. So for instance. There's a hierarchy of regenerative or generative cap capability with mechy stem cells. The top of that pyramid, the cells that are the, that have the greatest generative potential naturally are the mesenchymal stem cells from the placental material.

If you can imagine, when we get them day zero, they have just spent the last [00:13:00] nine months processing everything that's needed to create an entire perfect human being from two cells, right? So they have the generous potential and they have just demonstrated the generous potential to create perfect heart.

Lungs, bone, cartilage, skin, hair, eyes, brain, central nervous system, right? They have the degenerative potential for all that meaning they contain all the proteins, growth factors, and regenerative signals to create those things perfectly. They thus are the very top of the generative pyramid because they can create that.

Their exosomes contain all those things. One step down from that, meaning they have less proteins, growth factors and regenerative signals in lower concentrations are umbilical derived. So they're still super powerful, but they're about one third, the generative potency of placental derived of live tissue placental derive.

There's some other things that go into it as well. For instance, some one of the manufacturing methods for [00:14:00] exosomes is to take an original tissue source, an original master cell source, and take that cell source, put it into petri dishes, feed it protein, and replicate that source over and over again.

And then take the cells and exosomes from that replicated source, right? It's like making a copy of a copy of a copy. The same issue stands just like making a copy of a copy on a copy machine, quickly degrades the original definition. In the same way, when you keep making a copy of a copy from an original cell source, the generative potency quickly degrades and the concentration of those potent materials quickly degrades.

So we don't do that. We use only live tissue sourced and we use only placental. Umbilical messingham stem cell exosomes. One step below umbilical is they call them essentially MSC derived, which are taken from the hip. The iliac crest, that's an abundant [00:15:00] source of adult stem cells. That's really where all of our stem cells are generated in our iliac crest kind of pelvis area.

Those are very potent. One level down from that is adipose derived fat cell derived exosomes. So all these cells. Communicate with other cells through the mechanism of their exosomes, right? So exosomes is just how cells communicate. Top of the pyramid, placenta derived, then umbilical derived, then bone marrow derived, then adipose, fat cell derived it makes sense, right?

A fat cell was never designed to generate perfect brain material. That makes sense. So it's not going to have generative potential or regenerative potential in the central nervous system or in your for cardiac disease or pulmonary or respiratory disease because it never had those signals to begin with.

The placental and umbilical do have those signals to begin with, and so if we [00:16:00] can flood your body with those things, they will seek out where they're needed and start healing those things. One of the things that comes up is when people do a Google search, for instance, of exosomes, one of the Google AI prompts is the dark side of exosomes.

And of course, that's very ominous. What that is referring to is for, and you go to that and it says that exosomes play a role in cancer. What they mean is cancer cells also have cancer cell exosomes because that's how cells communicate. So cancer cells produce cancer cell exosomes. Now, there has never been a study that showed that therapeutic stem cell exosomes from placental or broken material that.

Fed cancer grew cancer that it brought back cancer that was in remission. Never. There's been two or three years of studies, so 50 to a hundred studies showing [00:17:00] exosomes being used as a treatment to downstream to two conditions downstream of cancer. And so an example is. When men, in a urology setting, when men have an oncological prostatectomy right pro prostate removal for cancer, that leads to something like 95% ed post prostatectomy Makes sense.

You're doing significant damage to the native tissue, including the blood vessels, the nerves, the tissue itself. They used exosomes to almost 100%. Treat that ed by regrowing, like native capillaries, nerves and tissue. So that's downstream of cancer. There's a hundred plus studies like that.

In the last year there's been maybe 20 studies where they're using therapeutic. Stem cell exosomes as an index treatment to fight cancer, to starve cancer [00:18:00] cells and block new cancer cells from forming. So I know in cervical cancer, breast cancer and glioblastoma, for instance, are three that I can think of studies that I've seen in the last 12 months.

That makes sense to me, knowing what the source material, the placenta material does in a cancer setting. It is a, dried placental material is used at for its cancer fighting properties. And so it makes sense that the cells from that placental material and the exosomes from those cells would have similar cancer fighting properties.

But kind of the studies are just catching up to that right now. 

Liz: Amazing. Amazing. So in terms of, someone, let's say, who's been diagnosed with, breast cancer, cervical cancer, prostate cancer. These exosome therapy, like the treatments, is this in addition to how do you advise or work with someone in that situation?

Is this, they're still following the normal procedures [00:19:00] with their provider, or is this a completely alternative care? 

Caleb Granger: For sure they're following what they're being advised with their oncology team. Where we are typically using this now is a post chemo or intra chemo. Combating the bodily wasting that comes from chemo.

It's incredible for that. As you can imagine, if you have something that is. Angiogenic. So blood vessel, regrowing, tissue tendon, ligament, nerve, regenerative and massively anti-inflammatory. That combination of things taken together can really be a boon to people who are going through the wasting effects of chemo.

So that's one that we very commonly do. We really this lemme just give you this environmental kind of background stem cells as a therapy. There's something like 7,500. Randomized controlled trials on stem cells, [00:20:00] right? It's massively studied, probably 40, 50,000 papers in the peer-reviewed public published literature on stem cells as a therapy over the last 25 years with varying results, but there's a massive amount of interest.

What from 1965 to 2019 is there's essentially no studies on exosomes. We didn't know. We knew they were there. We didn't know what they did or the role that they played. The thought prior to 2018 or 17 was that exosomes, these tiny particles were a waste byproduct of stem cell derivation. We knew they were there.

It was kinda like the dirty bath water after washing the baby. And in the late teens, it was discovered that not only were they not a waste byproduct, they were actually the thing that did the work, that did the healing work. In fact, the founder, the man who named mesenchymal stem cells published a study in 2018 saying that.

Upon further review, MSCs [00:21:00] shouldn't be called mesenchymal stem cells. They should be called medicinal signaling cells, because that's how they worked. They didn't do anything differentiating and engrafting. All they did was signal and what they signaled was exosomes. So that was in, that was Arnold Kaplan in 2018.

From 2020, so there was no studies from 1965 to 2019. From 2020 to today, there's close to 43,000 peer reviewed published studies on stem cell exosomes as a healing therapy. It is. There's never been anything you think about insulin, aspirin. Chemo. There's never been a therapy or a medical intervention that has this level of academic and clinical validation in the peer review literature in such a short period of time, and it's not even close.

Not one therapy. And doctors don't know this [00:22:00] and all sometimes, get as I'm out, talking about exosomes, oh, there's not enough data. Oh my gosh. There is so much data, hundreds of thousands. It really is a phenomenon. 

Becca Chilcz: Yeah. 

I'm curious 'cause I have two, one kind of a silly thought that popped into my head, but the other one, a question.

Are we worried that there are not gonna be enough female placenta that are clean and healthy at some point because of all of the things that, unfortunately, COVID did a number on the female body especially. Yes, the male body and the RA system and everything, but. One, I thought of that.

Like what if there aren't, I have tattoos. I, I know a lot of women. 

Caleb Granger: Sure yeah. 

Becca Chilcz: Healthy that and then having to be willing to donate it. But then the other question I had, and hopefully, you can touch on at the same token, but are there side effects that people have with exosome?

Even though exosomes are, so overall it seems like pretty much beneficial to anyone. Are there side effects that come with them potentially? 

Caleb Granger: So to answer the first question, we get, [00:23:00] we talk about exosomes and how they are abundantly available in nature, right? And they are, they're a hundred percent natural taken with no second steps.

We're not adding anything. It's not synthetic. We're just taking these signals from the mecom stem cells. We get an extraordinary amount per placenta. It's a there's a very complex process for getting the exosomes, for getting the stem cells, maintaining them, getting the exosome from those stem cells that is complex and expensive, but we get a bunch of 'em, from one placenta.

Could we conceivably, I would love nothing more. Because this is actually healing systems. It's actually stopping and reversing chronic and acute conditions. Every inflammatory or degenerative condition that we are familiar with as Americans in the Western world is being treated with stem cell exosomes stopped and reversed.

So I would love nothing more than for us to butt up against [00:24:00] that problem where we're having a supply problem, getting it out in a. Cost effective way, in a way that people can have access to 'em and we can be on protocols that are regenerative, actual anti-aging, anti organ aging, skin aging systems, aging.

I would love that. We're so far away from that right now. But I love the vision. It's may that be the case. Where everyone, like 

Becca Chilcz: drug companies are gonna try and stop you first and the medical institutions and because you'll put them outta business. Thousand percent. 

Caleb Granger: Listen, it's such a, we were talking before the show of what a small market this is right now.

It's an, the people who need it is a huge market, right? Even if you just focused on knee replacement surgery or hip replacement surgery. I saw in an article this morning that there's an expectation of close to a million hip replacements. Set for 2026 that are gonna be performed in the [00:25:00] US in 2026.

A million. 

Becca Chilcz: That's 

Caleb Granger: insane. That's extraordinary to me. And it's 

Liz: happening with all these people's hips. 

Becca Chilcz: I feel like I might need a knee replacement with my, I had they always say a C ls 30, 40 years down the line. 'cause I had mine 15 years ago and so they say that you probably increases your likelihood of by a lot to need a knee replacement at some point.

But maybe I can just go the route of exosome. 

Caleb Granger: Yes, so with our exosome protocols, what we can do reproducibly in three to six months is regrow cartilage in a bone on bone, osteoarthritic, knee, or hip average of 1.2 millimeters of new cartilage growth in knees. A little more than 1.3 millimeters of new cartilage growth in hips with an average age of 45.

This is from I'm sorry, 55 with users from 43 to 72. So big range, all osteoarthritic, all. Designated bone on bone [00:26:00] that do our protocols for 60 or 90 days, and then within three to six months have 90% or greater pain cessation, flexibility, increase, mobility increase, and 1.2 on average millimeters of new cartilage in the knee, 1.3 millimeters, new cartilage in the hip.

To give an example, people say, okay, that still doesn't sound like very much 1.2. The difference between healthy cartilage and bone on bone can be 0.3 millimeters of cartilage. So getting more than a millimeter is you are going back 15 years, 20 years biologically. 

Becca Chilcz: What about 

Caleb Granger: scar 

Becca Chilcz: tissue?

Can it ba, can it, does it work through scar tissue or what, 

Caleb Granger: yes. We see that especially like keloids is, it is a condition skin condition with scarring and just specifically with skin scarring. But you're talking about also, scar tissue in a joint. 

Becca Chilcz: Think of the example I think of my dad had a knee replacement.

Three, four years ago. He's 72, he has cancer, he has Parkinson's,

And he just did not recover like he his body [00:27:00] properly from the knee replacement. And he had even went in and tried to do the surgery because he was in so much pain. 'cause his range of motion is so bad. Yes. And honestly, like his knee hurts him more than any other thing that he's dealing with.

Caleb Granger: Yes. 

Becca Chilcz: And he's young, like he's 72. He is a place where he should be on his deathbed pretty soon. And I like, there's been so much scar tissue buildup essentially, and so we were trying to do therapy to break through it and like it was just so painful for him. And so I'm curious, like when there's been that much scar tissue buildup from a previous surgery, what ultimately can happen at that point?

Caleb Granger: Yes. What we see is when you change the surrounding environment when you can, again, up your regenerative capacity to the point that it's overwhelming your generation. The body then knows how to heal. We look at it and say, okay, diagnostically, we know there's this degeneration here, right? Because we have these incredible diagnostic tools that can point to, Hey, there's this area where I'm half a millimeter [00:28:00] here and I should be okay.

That's fine. What ends up happening in real life is we do the first week of our protocol, which is one IVSO DER iv, and the first six days of umbilical derived taken via sublingual daily. So it's a spray under the tongue. That we do morning and night. We've measured, that's week one of our protocol. So we've measured before the protocol, and then day seven of the protocol after one IV and 60 of the sublingual.

And in a variety of adults, all age range and health levels, we see on average a 500 to 1000% reduction in total body inflammation. It's crazy. So we knew before then that this is what patients were experiencing, right? They would have some orthopedic injury. They would start a protocol in week one or week two.

Yeah their orthopedic injury was doing great on that right knee, and their left knee fell better and the swelling in their second knuckles or arthritic [00:29:00] swelling had totally gone down. They could put their hand to a fist for the first time in three years, and the eczema behind their ear went away.

And the psoriasis on their elbow that they'd had for years that they had to do daily steroid cream had totally healed and their gums had grown back. It's

Becca Chilcz: yeah. 

Caleb Granger: It was. What we now know the effect of having your total in total body inflammation drop 500%. Inflammation is your body's alarm system that says when it's working well, that says, Hey, body, bring your natural healing capacity here to this point.

So if you have an elbow that's inflamed, ideally it gets inflamed and your body rushes healing properties to that area until the inflammation goes away. When your entire body is inflamed and you have diminished healing capacity, right? Diminished regenerative capacity. I think of it like a fireman.

I live in a neighborhood with 28 homes. If my fire [00:30:00] alarm was going off because of a pan fire on my stove and a fireman comes down the street, he can get out of his truck, hear my fire alarm going off, come into my home, know exactly what to do. That's a piece of cake for a fireman. If all eight homes on my side of the street are all going off.

When my one pan starts catching fire, now it's a lot tougher for him, right? He could conceivably go house by house. What if the entire neighborhood is going off? What if the entire city is going off? That fireman would be totally incapacitated. That's what happens to people's healing capacity.

They have regenerative capacity, but it can't even be used to heal a paper cut. Because their entire body is totally inflamed. And so that was one of the most gratifying things that, that we saw when we started doing these regenerative protocols, was if we can lower your talk about inflammation, even if we weren't adding more regenerative signals, zero day old, [00:31:00] massive amounts of regenerative signals, I hypothesize even if we, if the only thing it did was take away your inflammation, your own healing capacity becomes so much more efficient.

Yeah, it really is a phenomenon to see. One of the studies show that, for instance, I'm 50 years old, that as a 50-year-old, my native amount of mesenchymal stem cells that I have in my body is anywhere from 10 million to a hundred million that I'm circling around keeping that amount of 50-year-old mesenchymal stem cells in my body.

So that's my native healing regenerative capacity. That's one strong component of it with one iv. We add 500 million zero day old placental mesenchymal stem cells worth of signaling. So at best, like if I have the max amount that a 50-year-old would have a hundred million cells I'm doing in [00:32:00] one IV five times that regener.

Capacity I'm getting in one treatment in one five minute treatment, right? And so no wonder, right? And it could be 50 times my normal regenerative capacity. So it totally makes sense. We skyrocket your body's gross regenerative capacity and. Over time, it just overwhelms the degeneration. And so tendons grow back.

We've got a we work with celebrities and athletes. We've got about 30 NBA and NFL guys that are doing it as a regular protocol. Some of the top names, like the biggest names in the UFC that are doing that and many people that you see on tv, right? On these shows, some of 'em are dealing with just horrible.

Health conditions and they absolutely reverse. They just reverse. And it's after 5, 6, 7 years of these conditions, [00:33:00] you, we give enough regenerative capacity and your body now can regenerate like it did when you were a kid. 

Liz: Yeah. That's great. So a couple of questions, 'cause I know, when we talk about peptides and things for example, I had a, like adult hair and was using BPC 1 5 7 and TB 500, right?

And then all these, what about cancer growth and anything that stimulates growth? What do you say in terms of the exosomes, right? Are you putting people through extensive. Lab work or testing before you're using exosomes or what does that look like in terms of, if this does help with tissue regeneration and growth in the body, how do you, or what are your concerns around, obviously with cancer?

'cause I know you mentioned that it can help, right? In those cancer cases, but I'd just be curious on the intake process. 

Caleb Granger: Sure. Yeah. So we are the manufacturer. Apex Regenerative is the manufacturer, and we work with providers nationwide and [00:34:00] for sure health providers. We have company protocols. We've treated about 13,000 close to 13,500 patients now so far, and are on track this year.

Should treat about 20,000 more. And so we have a fair amount of experience. There's hundreds of thousands of patients in the peer reviewed literature that are siloed in the peer reviewed literature that are in published studies. There hasn't been something that shows.

Cancer initiation, cancer coming back or cancer growing through exosome use. I mentioned briefly that the source material from once we get these cells right, just the placental material, that material has been cleared by the FDA, meaning it was shown to be safe. Effective for the specific use for the specific use of a dural repair.

So the dura is like this thin wetsuit material that covers the brain and spinal cord. You get an intradural injection an [00:35:00] epidural that's meaning into the dura, into your spinal cord that's covered by the dura. So that. Among the highest price real estate in the body. The dura the placental material is used as a dural closure.

It's used as a dual healing like a bandaid to go the over the dura. So when you're doing brain surgery, that's been my business for the last 26 years is neurosurgery. Spine surgery and orthopedic surgery. That's, I've got intellectual property and those things and have made devices and that's been my business have done this started apex regenerative three years ago.

But what we know is there's 20 years of experience using the placental material in an oncological setting. So when you do a oncological tumor evacuation in the brain. We align that entire area with placental material because it has known cancer blocking and cancer starving. Capability. [00:36:00] The material itself does.

Same thing with mastectomies, take the tumor out, create a margin, and then coat that entire area with placental material because of those recognized anti-cancer properties. We have about five, six years of exosome data, right? There's a massive, there's 200 to 300 new studies being published every week, someone will, keep publishing on exosomes for use as an index therapy for cancer. They have, there's 20 studies or so that were published this last year, so that will continue. There isn't a whole lot of it right now. Primarily the way it's being used is as a anabolic catabolic agent.

After chemo. But there are some promising studies showing it for its cancer fighting properties. And again, because of my experience in spine and neurosurgery and orthopedic surgery, how it's being used there, how the source material is, that gives me confidence that okay, we will find out that this is, cancer fighting because the tissue's not gonna [00:37:00] be cancer fighting and it cells not be cancer fighting.

Becca Chilcz: Yeah. Okay. So two questions. One back to, are there side effects? Two? 

If people stop them at some point, like they get to a place where their body's in a better place and they, the treatment, is there a fast regression? Is there like, or are they stable for a while? Like curious how or what You 

Caleb Granger: Great question.

Yeah, that's a great question. So in hundreds of thousands of patients in the literature, in 13,000 plus of our own patients, not one adverse event, not one exosome related kind of symptomology, that came not one adverse reaction. Compare that to even PRP, right? Platelet rich plasma, taking your own blood draws, concentrate it and put it back to you.

People have a response to that. You can have an inflammatory. It's very inflammatory. Same thing with stem cells. One of my good friends using her own stem cells, spinning 'em down and putting 'em back in, had an [00:38:00] anaphylactic response to her own stem cells. That's totally possible, just from them being out in the environment and coming back into you and going through the processing process.

So has never been anything like that. And again, it's because the exosomes. Can't carry the things that create those responses. So they have a real hard time carrying viral and bacterial load. They don't carry any genetic material and they're totally anti-inflammatory. Those are all the things that would lead to some sort of a response or some sort of an adverse event.

And recognized incredibly safe risk profile, probably 10% of all the literature is a sub genre. Of using exosomes where the patients were too genetically compromised or immune compromised to be able to use stem cell therapy where they needed stem cell therapy, but they couldn't do it because they were too compromised and the stem cells would create some [00:39:00] inflammatory or reaction.

And in those situations, they use exosomes safely and effectively. So that is its own genre. Probably 10% of the literature that's published is in that genre. Your question of what happens when you stop taking it. It's a great question. And the way that most of us think about pharmacological intervention, right?

And things like peptides, right? Anything that acts on the system, there's always gonna be a negative, is what we are used to. The example I give is, for instance, 50-year-old. Guys have reduced natural testosterone production. And so what do you do? You get on exogenous testosterone if your testosterone production is already naturally low.

The issue is you start flooding your body with exogenous testosterone. What do you think happens to your natural production? It was already low. Now it totally drops out. So if you got off of that testosterone now. You started here, it's [00:40:00] in the basement, right? Your natural production, that's the normal process with exosomes.

It's totally different with exosomes. Every amount that you're taking in, it's not just covering a symptom. It's not artificially pumping up one receptor and dampening another. It's actually regenerating the areas that are causing the symptoms. For instance, with my dad, he had zero and 20% kidney function At 93 years old.

He started doing monthly IVs, daily sublingual, and daily intranasal. That was in April of 24. By June of 24, his 0% kidney was still at zero. His 20% kidney was at 90% function by the next year, beginning of last year, 25, his 0% kidney was at 40%, and then he still had his 90% kidney. They call that a fully functioning kidney, right?

So he went from zero and 20 to 40 and 90 on this very high exosome dose [00:41:00] if he stopped taking those exosomes today. Would his kidneys go back down to zero and 20? No. They've actually regenerated kidney material. So he would still be 94. He would be degenerating. He would not be overwhelming his degeneration with regenerative capacity like he has been doing, but it would start from a new increased health level that was much higher than when he started.

So that's exactly what happens. The people that get 1.2 millimeters of new cartilage growth in their bone on bone knee and their osteoarthritic bone on bone knee. That 1.2 millimeters, it's actual native tissue cartilage. It doesn't just drop out and melt away. When they stop taking the exosomes that has regrown, it will start degenerating again, based on their activity level and their natural kind of genetic predisposition and the environment and that sort of thing.

But you start from a new higher health level. 

Becca Chilcz: Got it. It's amazing. [00:42:00] 

Caleb Granger: It really is. It's it's all that we hoped. For 25 years that stem cells would be, 

Becca Chilcz: yeah. 

Caleb Granger: But it's really doing it and it's doing it with no side effects, with no, the much lower risk profile and significantly more concentrated and often at half the cost.

Becca Chilcz: Yeah. So let's talk cost really fast before. I don't I'm it and extremely amazed and I feel like I have all of my questions answered. I don't know if you have other questions, but I'd be curious on cost. In terms of obviously aggressive treatment is gonna be a little bit more expensive if someone's doing all the things for, multiple months in terms of injections and IVs and intranasal and sublingual and all that.

But just curious in terms of like average cost. 

Caleb Granger: Yeah, so typically we can do multi treatment protocols. What we don't do is a single intervention, right? I mentioned the IV providing five to 50 times as a 50-year-old, my native amount of stem cells. That's what one IV [00:43:00] does. That's a lot. You get an incredible result just from one iv.

I, the first IV I did, I had 35 years of tinnitus, ringing in my ears, totally heal, never came back. I wasn't expecting that that happened. 

Liz: Have you alluded that to the ladies in menopause? Yeah, because there's not been. We've gone down all kinds of rabbit holes on this, and so that's amazing because I can't tell you the amount of women that we talked to that have had this either post COVID or with menopause induced.

So if you're not marketing that, we gotta marketing it to those ladies because they need hope. And then in terms of, you said, okay, that was one iv. 

Caleb Granger: Yes. 

Liz: Cost wise, are we talking a thousand dollars, $5,000, or It depends upon, 

Caleb Granger: yeah so typically what I was gonna say is that, that we have moved away from doing one intervention because often these are chronic conditions that have lasted for, I'm thinking of a guy who came from Denmark.

He was a professional musician, and it took him four IVs to get resolution of hisson that was still an [00:44:00] incredible value for him, right? Because this was his profession. It was just something that he had dealt with for a long time. What we do is typically 60 and 90 day protocols made up of multiple interventions, and the foundation of those things are one IVs, whether, multiple IVs, what we'll do based on the severity of the condition and the type of condition.

Increase or decrease those numbers, the number of IVs that you do we'll do also sublingual daily. We get about a 20 to 30% increase in healing when we add the sublingual component daily. Just having a solid state amount of exosomes going through your system every day is just super valuable. And and then we also do in October of last year, I acquired what is the only intracellular NAD.

Increasing supplement. So it's called ized, NAD. NAD is the the single kind of battery pack for [00:45:00] all your cells, not just your stem cells, for all your cells. That also degrades over time, 50% degradation every 20 years, some studies say, and so basically your cellular power degrades over time.

The typical many people are familiar with NAD. The way NAD is supplemented now is via iv. Intermuscular injection or supplementation, oral supplementation, all of those simply raise your blood plasma, NAD levels, so they temporarily raise the amount of NAD in your system. And then there's a plaque enzyme response as your body tries to flush out that NAD, that high level of Exogen d.

Out of your system. And so people feel that when they're doing the IVs. You have to really meter how quickly you can get the IV because your body is saying, get this out quickly. It's trying to process it out quickly and it never raises your intracellular NAD. The amount of NAD in your cell doesn't rise with rs, which is the oral powder dissolved [00:46:00] in water swished and swallowed.

It gets through your mucosal membranes and your sub weal glands. We raise your intracellular NAD on average in humans human study, 53% in five days, 300% in 30 days. So we can reproducibly raise your intracellular and it has no effect on your blood plasma, NAD, so there's no symptoms or side effects. No arrhythmias, no.

Break it out in a cold sweat or feeling nauseous. None of that, just a sense of wellbeing. Faster recovery. The feeling that you get when you ha almost like you're about to cry with joy, in your chest. It's a phenomenon. It's crazy to experience. So where 

Liz: that, 

Caleb Granger: What's that? 

Liz: I said where do you buy that?

Because I'm looking on the website. Is that something that anyone could buy or you have to have that a prescribed through a provider? 

Caleb Granger: Yeah, so anyone we can ship that direct to the patient anywhere in the world. The exosomes are only through provider and are anywhere in the us. [00:47:00] But the LNAD ized, NAD ization, is our proprietary process takes a commercial NAD molecule, which is large and unstable.

So that's what you get when you're doing an iv, when you do intermuscular injection, and it's what they coat with, for instance, like liposomal, NAD and these sorts of things. That's just a coating, like you would safety coat an aspirin to help it get down into the stomach. What we do is we take that large unstable commercial molecule from food grade NAD.

The ization process uses. Pressure, temperature, time, and motion. If you can imagine in a machine through multiple passes to take water and air impurities out of the NAD molecule, it makes it smaller and more bioidentical, more similar to the NAD that your body uses for fuel, and that's what we get. That's what we supply and what you're able to put in your body and why it doesn't create a blood plasma.

NAD [00:48:00] spike, only an intracellular NAD spike. We're launching that commercially for the first time. It's been around from that manufacturer for five years. They have five years of human studies. It is WADA and USADA certified, able to be used NCAA in high school athletics professional Olympic athletics.

So that's something that we're using with a lot of our athletes for the obvious reasons, but we're also doing it as our protocols. It's a two-prong approach. We can raise your intercellular, NAD, raise the power of all your cells, and then with exosomes direct, all those newly powered up cells where and how to heal.

And so when we do those two things, we get just an extraordinary regenerative response where we're rebuilding like native tissue, like native organs. You asked at the beginning about what my experience was. I've of course, been doing these protocols now in my second year, first year I did protocol all year long.

One, one great example is there's a measure called Hs, [00:49:00] CRP. And that's the most discriminating measure of total body inflammation. My SCRP in December of 20, three was 2.3, so that's mid low for a 48-year-old. Decent amount. I did every other month IVs and halfway through the year of that year of 24, I started doing daily sublingual.

And December of 24, it was 1.2, went from 2.3 to 1.2. Last year I did monthly IVs, daily sublingual, and starting October did daily LN 80 plus. December of 25, it was my Hs. CRP was 0.1. It's the lowest registrable. CRP score, but it's the total body inflammation of a 7-year-old. And and that's what I feel.

So you talk about not [00:50:00] having, joint pain or tendon pain and I try to be really active and was an athlete in college. I was still trying to at 50 play basketball. I recently went out after workout, dunked the ball. 20 times, right? I'm six two. White guy dunked the ball 20 times, 10 years ago, not on exosomes.

My knees would've been hurt, my calves would've been hurt. My achilles would've hurt the inner components of my feet right, would've ached. None of that happened at 50. And so it's it's a massive, all of my age related biomarkers. We see on our protocols reduced 70 to a hundred plus percent in a year.

And you think about that's a five to 15 year biological age reversal when you can take your A-S-T-A-L, T A1C, take your [00:51:00] A1C down. Two, three points, right? That's a life changing thing. And often for people that those are two, three points that they've accrued over 15 or 20 years.

We reproducibly reverse those. And it's not because we're dampening one thing and raising the other, it's because we're actually, the body is healing and regenerating the systems that are dysfunctioning. 

Becca Chilcz: Yeah. Okay, so this has been amazing. 

Caleb Granger: Yes. And the cost you 

Becca Chilcz: Yeah, the cost. 

Caleb Granger: You asked about the cost. Yes.

So typically what we'll do with these protocols 60 and 90 day protocols are typically how we start for a chronic, ongoing, meaning longer than six months, typically as many years that people have had these conditions. And it'll include L 80 plus IVs, some number of IVs, and daily sublingual.

All of those three things for a certain time period, those are usually we can do that in a way that has a meaningful impact on people for the long term, for high four figures to low five figures. [00:52:00] 

Becca Chilcz: Got it. 

Caleb Granger: Depending on the condition 

Becca Chilcz: for what it's doing. Yeah. It's, 

Caleb Granger: it's incredible. And so we're talking about literally trillions of placental, mesenchymal stem cells worth of healing 

Becca Chilcz: Yeah.

Caleb Granger: That are being delivered for that much, for instance, for $20,000. 

Becca Chilcz: Yeah. 

Caleb Granger: Compare that to. Going and getting one stem cell injection from your orthopedic specialists, right? Oftentimes those will be 15, $17,000, 12, 15, $17,000 for 20 million cells, right? We can do for anywhere from 3,500 to 6,500 depending on the market, 500 million cells.

Zero day old placental mechy stem cells worth of healing signals delivered in one IV push. 

Becca Chilcz: Yeah, that's crazy. Okay, so obviously, so you're. Like producer of this and you 

Caleb Granger: That's right. 

Becca Chilcz: Apply different places. So if people are interested in this, how would they, like I'm thinking if there's a [00:53:00] support for someone in Chicago, obviously 

Caleb Granger: Sure.

Becca Chilcz: That gets, supply from you or that you have connections with, but like how do people figure that out? How do, how can they find, 

yeah. 

Caleb Granger: How can they 

Becca Chilcz: find out information? 

Caleb Granger: Sure. So reach out to us. Our website is the apex medical.com and all our socials TikTok. IG and Facebook are at Apex Regenerative and so encourage everyone to follow those.

We, post a bunch of testimonials and educational material and contact us there. We're happy to work with your provider wherever you are. It's very efficient. Also, we're based in Austin, Texas, and so we're in every major. Texas Metro area. We also provide directly IVs via our concierge white glove service in every Texas metro in LA and Orange County, and right now in South Florida.

Liz: Okay. 

Caleb Granger: So if you're in any of those areas, we can essentially do those protocols directly with you. And if we need to do a acute injection, which is about [00:54:00] 15 to 20% of people actually need, even if they have degenerative knees. Just doing the systemic protocol will heal those. 

Becca Chilcz: Yeah, 

Caleb Granger: and so you know, the vast majority of the time, 75, 80% of the time, the only time we're really doing acute injections is when you have a constant 7, 8, 9, or 10 out of 10 pain or disability with that joint.

Anything less than that, we see incredible results. Just raising your gross, regenerative capacity in your body. When we do that, then that takes care of itself. Okay. 

Liz: What about for someone that has fibromyalgia or just total body pain? 

Caleb Granger: It's incredible for that. Again, so much of fibromyalgia, Hashimoto's and these sorts of things that have no resolution in the medical industrial complex and are inflammatory in nature.

When you can reduce your total body inflammation, reproducibly 500 to a thousand percent, the relief that people get [00:55:00] is just massive. It's incredible also for any brain-based condition, Parkinson's, Alzheimer's, vascular, dementia, traumatic brain injury autism. Those are. The most gratifying patient stories, are the pediatric autism cases where we're doing intranasal exosomes.

I think because of course, the parents are so dialed into every little intricacy and mannerism. And when you have a 13-year-old whose, you know, nonverbal non locomotive, right? As a parent, of course, your heart just breaks. And we have the opportunity to do something with an intranasal, a hundred percent natural spray where, I'm thinking of a text I got in a week of doing that.

This nonverbal never made eye contact and non locomotive, so wheelchair bound. Teenager, the text was essentially, Hey, they're pacing [00:56:00] around their room and won't shut up. Oh my God. And so it's just went in the total opposite direction and of course they were overjoyed. Yeah. It was just absolutely unbelievable.

And. The, with such low risk, with such high, you, the only two things are gonna happen is it's gonna heal partially or it's gonna heal. Totally. 

Liz: Yeah. 

Caleb Granger: Those are the two things.